Ryan Wilson: Mason, Fleury Shine In Dominate Penguins 4-1 Victory Penguins defeat the Philadelphia Flyers 4-1

Fleury was fantastic.

I didn't see the game, but heard that the Penguins made the Flyers look absolutely terrible, and Bill Meltzer went as far as to say they looked like an ECHL team in the 2nd period. So really, it's tough to say anything other than the Penguins are a far, far superior team right now, especially mentally. I believe the overall skill of the 2 teams is closer than the records indicate, but right now, the Penguins are as confident as can be, and the Flyers are about as down as can be. A well-deserved win for the Penguins.

I didn't see the game, but heard that the Penguins made the Flyers look absolutely terrible, and Bill Meltzer went as far as to say they looked like an ECHL team in the 2nd period. So really, it's tough to say anything other than the Penguins are a far, far superior team right now, especially mentally. I believe the overall skill of the 2 teams is closer than the records indicate, but right now, the Penguins are as confident as can be, and the Flyers are about as down as can be. A well-deserved win for the Penguins.
- jmatchett383

Its probably a smaller sample size than I would like to draw from to make the following statement but I think the flyers are exactly who they are right now.

They aren't the victim of bad luck, and they aren't the beneficiaries of good luck.

I see their scoring problems improving but Mason slightly regressing, so in the end it will all even out.

Its probably a smaller sample size than I would like to draw from to make the following statement but I think the flyers are exactly who they are right now.

They aren't the victim of bad luck, and they aren't the beneficiaries of good luck.

I see their scoring problems improving but Mason slightly regressing, so in the end it will all even out.
- Ryan_Wilson

I don't think "luck" as anything to do with it. Is it possible that every player had a career year all at the same time in 11/12? Yes (we saw it with the 1993 Phillies). But even on a horrible team last year, Giroux was a PPG player, Voracek continued trending upwards, and guys like Simmonds and Read kept up their pace (slightly down, but close). Luke Schenn came out as a top-pair shutdown candidate playing up to 32 minutes as a very good shutdown player. Kimmo Timonen was 4th in defenseman scoring when he got hurt.

Again, is it possible that the entire team is regressing within a year and 7 months? Yes. Not probably, though. I'm not saying that they're on the same level as the Pens talent-wise, but at the same time, I think it's more mentality, confidence, and lack of effort that's hurting them right now.

I don't think "luck" as anything to do with it. Is it possible that every player had a career year all at the same time in 11/12? Yes (we saw it with the 1993 Phillies). But even on a horrible team last year, Giroux was a PPG player, Voracek continued trending upwards, and guys like Simmonds and Read kept up their pace (slightly down, but close). Luke Schenn came out as a top-pair shutdown candidate playing up to 32 minutes as a very good shutdown player. Kimmo Timonen was 4th in defenseman scoring when he got hurt.

Again, is it possible that the entire team is regressing within a year and 7 months? Yes. Not probably, though. I'm not saying that they're on the same level as the Pens talent-wise, but at the same time, I think it's more mentality, confidence, and lack of effort that's hurting them right now.
- jmatchett383

I know, I said exactly that, verbatim.

"They aren't the victim of bad luck, and they aren't the beneficiaries of good luck."

This is your team.

And I won't agree about Luke Schenn, he is not a good player, nor has he been used in a shutdown role based on his player usage charts from the past 3 years.

That JVR for Luke Schenn trade is one of the most lopsided trades in recent memory.

Gunner, I am seeing that Neal has been placed on long term injured reserve and has a muscle tear in his shoulder. Have you seen that as well?

The Flyers are a terrible team right now. They played a flawed system with no emotion. All but Mason and Rinaldo look like they are going through the emotions every night.

Its disheartening to watch.

Gunner, I am seeing that Neal has been placed on long term injured reserve and has a muscle tear in his shoulder. Have you seen that as well?
- powerhouse

John Toperzer has reported the following:

James Neal: Week-to-week.
Editor’s Note — A trusted source has told me Neal has a torn muscle around the rib cage area.

http://chippedhamsports.c...3789&post_format=standard

I don't think "luck" as anything to do with it. Is it possible that every player had a career year all at the same time in 11/12? Yes (we saw it with the 1993 Phillies). But even on a horrible team last year, Giroux was a PPG player, Voracek continued trending upwards, and guys like Simmonds and Read kept up their pace (slightly down, but close). Luke Schenn came out as a top-pair shutdown candidate playing up to 32 minutes as a very good shutdown player. Kimmo Timonen was 4th in defenseman scoring when he got hurt.

Again, is it possible that the entire team is regressing within a year and 7 months? Yes. Not probably, though. I'm not saying that they're on the same level as the Pens talent-wise, but at the same time, I think it's more mentality, confidence, and lack of effort that's hurting them right now.
- jmatchett383

I think they have some good talent (certainly better than the record), but it appears several of the players are comfortable and satisfied with their big contracts. So yeah, I largely agree that a big part of their problem is mentality. That 2nd period last night was as bad as it gets for an NHL team. The Flyers looked like they would rather be playing xbox or something. Confidence had nothing to do with it.

I also think their D is poorly constructed.

Solid performance (with the exception of the last minute or 3 of the 2nd and the first 5 minutes of the 3rd) and about the expected result given the lineups & playing styles. There was a period where the Flyers legitimately looked like they didn't even know what to do in the 2nd period. They were entirely in awe of what they saw the Pens doing on the other side. Everything they tried to do, the Pens had an answer for and everything the Pens tried to do, they accomplished.

The Flyers are just not a good team and not constructed properly. They've got a lot of overpaid 3rd liners playing 2nd line duties, overpaid 4th liners in the 3rd line duties and mid-pairing D-men playing top pairing duties and getting paid like it. They're a team of mediocre rather than a mix of great, solid and serviceable like the Pens. With the exception of Giroux, and maybe sometimes Vorachek, they're not very talented. It's a team of Max Talbots. Guys that will work hard and occasionally play the hero, but can't be relied on to do the job night in, night out.

And that's without even getting into their defense. That's just a mess. I honestly think that, were it not for the fact that it's the Flyers and Shero probably wouldn't piss on them if they were on fire and they're in the same division, the Flyers would pretty much give up a kings ransom for a guy like Niksanen in a trade right now just so they had a solid puck mover that was relatively cheap and young and not a complete poopshow in his own defensive end.

I'd kill to have Simmonds bouncing up and down between the Pens 2nd and 3rd lines in different situations though. Think we could get Philly to make a Nisky for Simmonds deal where they also eat some of the salary?

John Toperzer has reported the following:

James Neal: Week-to-week.
Editor’s Note — A trusted source has told me Neal has a torn muscle around the rib cage area.

http://chippedhamsports.c...3789&post_format=standard
- Ryan_Wilson

Yes, that is the hot rumor around town. The other part of it is he hurt it playing wiffle ball at practice....yikes.

Yes, that is the hot rumor around town. The other part of it is he hurt it playing wiffle ball at practice....yikes.
- madmike71

If he did hurt it during the wiffle ball practice I don't care. That kind of team bonding stuff has great positive benefits and is great for morale. I don't want them to stop doing it because of a fluke injury.

If he did hurt it during the wiffle ball practice I don't care. That kind of team bonding stuff has great positive benefits and is great for morale. I don't want them to stop doing it because of a fluke injury.
- Ryan_Wilson

Might as well take away forks and knives at the dinner table too, just to be safe.

Might as well take away forks and knives at the dinner table too, just to be safe.
- BulliesPhan87

NO RUNNING WITH SCISSORS!! YOU'LL POKE YOUR EYE OUT!

Sorry... I think I was just possessed by the not-yet-dead spirit of my mom. Weird.

The Flyers are a terrible team right now. They played a flawed system with no emotion. All but Mason and Rinaldo look like they are going through the emotions every night.

Its disheartening to watch.
- flyers2001

With all that said they had every chance to tie that game in the first 10 minutes of the 3rd. They just aren't confident with the puck on their stick right now.

Based on the number of chances they got (Schenn and Voracek both missed gimmies) I think there is light at the end of the tunnel. I didn't think you were a slam dunk playoff team coming into the season and obviously my thought hasn't changed, but it will get better than it has been and based on the rest of the conference playoffs are still going to be a possibility if they get it turned around.

NO RUNNING WITH SCISSORS!! YOU'LL POKE YOUR EYE OUT!

Sorry... I think I was just possessed by the not-yet-dead spirit of my mom. Weird.
- ScienceJesus

You'll get that from time to time, in a small forum such as this.

John Toperzer has reported the following:

James Neal: Week-to-week.
Editor’s Note — A trusted source has told me Neal has a torn muscle around the rib cage area.

http://chippedhamsports.c...3789&post_format=standard
- Ryan_Wilson

OK, thank you for the clarification. Appreciate it.

OK, thank you for the clarification. Appreciate it.
- powerhouse

Might not be an official diagnoses but I'm sure John's guy is telling him the truth.

If he did hurt it during the wiffle ball practice I don't care. That kind of team bonding stuff has great positive benefits and is great for morale. I don't want them to stop doing it because of a fluke injury.
- Ryan_Wilson

You should have seen the comments when the Pens twitter feed posted pictures of them playing flag football out at West Point. People wondering why they would risk injury playing flag football on turf. They realize they play hockey right?

With all that said they had every chance to tie that game in the first 10 minutes of the 3rd. They just aren't confident with the puck on their stick right now.

Based on the number of chances they got (Schenn and Voracek both missed gimmies) I think there is light at the end of the tunnel. I didn't think you were a slam dunk playoff team coming into the season and obviously my thought hasn't changed, but it will get better than it has been and based on the rest of the conference playoffs are still going to be a possibility if they get it turned around.
- canadianpenfan

Maybe. However their defense is having a good bit of difficulty clearing the puck reliably. Hard to be confident when you are in your own zone so much. As much as Flyer fans want more offensive talent it's the other end of the ice they need a solid stay at home defenseman. Pens were unimpeded much of the night.

With all that said they had every chance to tie that game in the first 10 minutes of the 3rd. They just aren't confident with the puck on their stick right now.

Based on the number of chances they got (Schenn and Voracek both missed gimmies) I think there is light at the end of the tunnel. I didn't think you were a slam dunk playoff team coming into the season and obviously my thought hasn't changed, but it will get better than it has been and based on the rest of the conference playoffs are still going to be a possibility if they get it turned around.
- canadianpenfan

Aside from the Pens, the Real Atlantic Division (as opposed to that fraudulent one) is garbage. But the Flyers really have to find ways to win games (and not by accident like the Florida game) soon if they want a shot.

You should have seen the comments when the Pens twitter feed posted pictures of them playing flag football out at West Point. People wondering why they would risk injury playing flag football on turf. They realize they play hockey right?
- Deadstar

They are human beings who need to relax somehow. Better than going out partying.

Can a team have an ugly 6-1 record? Because that's what it feels like to me. There are some major issues that need to be corrected, playing 3 full periods would be at the top of my list. I felt we were lucky last night.

But that second period looked like me and my friends on the outdoor rink against a bunch of kids on skates for the first time. Gunner you're a numbers guy, can you track down an offensive zone time of possession stat for that period?

NO RUNNING WITH SCISSORS!! YOU'LL POKE YOUR EYE OUT!

Sorry... I think I was just possessed by the not-yet-dead spirit of my mom. Weird.
- ScienceJesus

It's just science, jesus.